[CIMC-work] (f.y.i.) Fw: [Imc-finance] Re: letter confirming " some LACK OF TRANSPARENCY??"

[Chris Kaihatsu]

___

Release all people from Guantanamo Bay and replace them with the true (war)
criminals: the capitalist ruling class and all Americanist associates

- (me), Chris Kaihatsu, 2-3-04





----- Original Message -----
From: "sphinx" <sphinx at indymedia.org>
To: "blue.pi" <blue.pi at so36.net>
Cc: <joeri at indymedia.org>; "Glenda Loebell" <glloebell at yahoo.com>; "Michaela
Kvasnicka" <michaela.k at dplanet.ch>; <chema at no-log.org>;
<imc-finance at lists.indymedia.org>; "maureen" <mauranda at bluewin.ch>
Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2004 9:03 AM
Subject: [Imc-finance] Re: letter confirming " some LACK OF TRANSPARENCY??"


> Hello Blue and others ! it will be a TRIBBLE disaster if as a results of
my mail
> ACTIVISTS GET SCARED to air their views and ask qustions as well as raise
> concerns on this list or any other network list. Please understand me, I
was
> upset by the accusation of "seeming lack of TRANSPARENCY by the
ORGANISERS"; of
> which I've been the main one(organiser) working 24-7 to make this whole
thing
> happen. And if anything, there is hardly any decision that has been taken
> without repeatly informing others and asking for opinions, in network
mailing
> lists, and endless irc meetings whose logs are on the twiki. If Chema had
stated
> what made him say the process was seemly untransparent then I could have
tried
> to respond to the concerned in question. BUT to just through it like that
(that
> there was seemly lack of TRANSPERENCY  on the part of the ORGANISERS)
without
> substantiating was simply too much.
>
> I come from a society where, one does everything to avoid finding oneself
in a
> situation where their intergrity could be questioned. I can hardly imagine
> anything that will hurt as the accusation of lacking transperency in an
activity
> . It puts everything to question; your effords, your personality, your
> intentions and what have you?. I know some of this explanation may still
just
> not make sense to some activists on this list. But if you were a black
male who
> have fought for years against a perverse African regime you know has it's
main
> support from known so-called democracies; If you have been dehumanised and
> striped of all what is known as humanrights by the laws in one of those
> so-called democracies that you know support the regime you have waisted
your
> life fighting-just because you came there to take refuge. In a situation
where
> every three police officers that see you on the street one will have to
stop and
> control you just because you are black.
> Then, you are left just with one thing and that is your INTERGRITY. And
you only
> get involved in projects or with people you know value that intergrity of
yours.
>  Now if even in that milieu, that ones-last-thing-that-is-left-for-you
comes
> under attack then you will explode. I bet you will.
>
> I'm so excited about indymedia becuase of the possibility to respect
others as
> well as be respected by them; knowing you all mean to practice what you
claim to
> stand for. Being sensitive enough but not formal.
>
>
>
> Quoting "blue.pi" <blue.pi at so36.net>:
>
> > Woh! I don't know if this is some internal dispute or soemthing. But I
sure
> >
> > don't feel comfortable to ask questions (may they be innocent or stupid)
on
> >
> > this list of this is what can happen.
> >
> > But there also seems to be some basic misunderstanding. Chema is nothing
of
> >
> > a director or that sort, nor is there any imc-finance administration.
> > (Actually Chema probably asked the questions he asked because he is not
so
> > super active globally and hasn't seen the other discussions - at least I
> > have never come across him)
> >
> > Some people here, like Sasha and Sheri, manage a whole lot of stuff and
> > therefore probably also know about many things that are going on. Others
are
> >
> > less active and simply a country liason because each IMC has to have
one.
> >
> > If we want people to be more active on this list (which has been
demanded
> > several times), we must allow those people who don't know about
everything
> > that's going on in the network to also ask questions and raise concerns.
> >
> > blue
> >
> > sphinx writes:
> >
> > > Dear Chema! Though you tried hard to mask this typical arrogant CEO
> > attitude
> > > that one meets every now and then in the network with words like
"seems"
> > > and "perhaps" the fact is, this recklessness and freehanded manner of
some
> > of
> > > you gives the desire to spew.
> > >
> > > Yes, it is true that Glenda though old in the field of struggle in
Africa
> > is
> > > new to indymedia and have hardly taken time to acquaint herself with
the
> > > internal structure and functioning of the network; which have ended
her the
> >
> > > reputation of addressing mails at times to the wrong list. Or simply
> > addressing
> > > herself to activist with content of discussions which leaves some
activist
> > at
> > > the lost of what she is talking about, as the activists at times are
not
> > > involved in the discussion being addresses to them by Glenda. Of
which, i
> > can
> > > understand your inability to figure-out the meaning of her mail. For
which
> >
> > > reason the administration of the imc-finance list did not approve of
her
> > mail
> > > through imc-finance lists. Yet my purpose of writing is not to discuss
the
> >
> > > Glenda style. it is rather to handle this insult-ive mail of yours.
> > >
> > > The discussion on the Dakar conference have been going on for than
6months
> > now
> > > in indymedia mailing lists and the indymedia IRC server. This peroid
have
> >
> > > included endless hours of contributions and efforts by individuals. It
has
> > as
> > > well involved serious financial contributions by individuals in making
> > endless
> > > expensive phone calls to africa and elsewhere, making trips to attend
> > meetings
> > > with other groups who are involved in the tour to Africa in the frame
of
> > which
> > > the idea of the conference came up and many more sacrifices.
> > >
> > > And in all of that, the results of your "BUSY INVESTIGATION" is that
there
> > SEEM
> > > to be SOME LACK OF TRANSPERENCY in the in the organisation of this
> > conference.
> > > YET YOU COULD NOT list THESE seemly non transperency in Organising
this
> > > conference "which you are hoping will improve".
> > >
> > > Then you go :
> > > <I am not
> > > < at all sure that the priority is to have such a meeting given the
large
> > > < sums of money being talked about in IMC Finance.
> > >
> > > Did you read the mails sent to imc-finance??
> > > Or in the typical boss-style you did not see any reason to read the
> > content.
> > > You can criticise without reading, afterall if the worker thinks there
is
> >
> > > something to clarify they will have no other option but to come
begging for
> > an
> > > audience to the boss to clarify.
> > >
> > > I'M not going to take that arrogance from you or any body that is too
full
> >
> > > enough of him(most of the time)self to understand that we are in a
> > community to
> > > discuss with sincerity and commitment to move the overall project
forward.
> >
> > > You probably think you are part of the board of directors of indymedia
who
> > can
> > > throw away others(especially those from below) ideas away with a wave
of
> > the
> > > hand without the need for discussion.
> > >
> > > Alright boss, let me explain. The sum requested is mostly to cover
> > transport
> > > cost of the delegates from within africa coming to the conference. It
is
> > not to
> > > pay for the safari of those ORGANISING THE CONFERENCE.
> > >
> > >>From your busy investigation you found out that 6000Euros could be
used <to
> > buy
> > > computers and net connections? 6,000 euros in equipment
> > > < could kickstart a good amount of IMC in Africa.
> > >
> > > REALLLY??? If there was a bill for computers sent to imc-finance could
you
> > not
> > > have reminded us of the lack of bandwith and other similar
infrastructure
> > in
> > > Africa. Anyway after buying computers for 6000euros what next do we
do??
> > may be
> > > send  the computers to Africa and have the activists walk on foot to
some
> > place
> > > and pick them for use in KICKSTARTING A GOOD AMOUNT OF IMCS.
> > >
> > >
> > > To you last questions just another exposure of this managing director
> > attitude.
> > > There you go :
> > >> What University and Professor are you talking about? What sort of
> > >> fundraising are you doing? Could you send more detailed information
to
> > the
> > >> IMC Finance list?
> > >
> > > Ja ! Glenda should go the the African lists and the twiki pages where
all
> > the
> > > other irc meetings have been achived and prepare a report and SEND it
to
> > the
> > > director!
> > >
> > > Now with this kind of arrogance the network will be distroyed.
> > >
> > > Chema! next time when you are writing about an issue or may be if you
have
> >
> > > things you don't understand about an issue, like a comrade ASK
QUESTIONS
> > about
> > > the ISSUE and don't jump into any rach conclusions and much less
insults.
> > If
> > > you don't know to insinuate that those dealing with a particular
project
> > are
> > > not exactly transparent without any reason is very very destructive,
> > insult-
> > > ive  and annoying.
> > >
> > > Indymedia have a finance list and not a finance director to enchourage
> > frank
> > > and sincere exchange on financial issues and not to give a poduim for
those
> > who
> > > wish to play bosses. There is a BIG difference between raising
concerns and
> >
> > > worreis as have been going in imc-finance since there start of the
> > discussion
> > > on this issue and this provoking mail of yours below.
> > >
> > > Sphinx
> > > imc Africa working group
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Quoting chema at no-log.org:
> > >
> > >> Dear Glenda,
> > >>
> > >> Sorry for the late reply. I got your mail two weeks ago, but I wasn't
> > >> quite sure what it was and I was quite busy to investigate. I am
still
> > not
> > >> sure what you refer to, since I couldn't open the attached files you
> > sent
> > >> in the second mail. Could you please resend them as pdf or txt?
> > >>
> > >> I am not sure what conference you are refering to. Perhaps it is the
IMC
> > >> Africa one? There seems to be some lack of transparency in the
> > >> organization of this conference, which will hopefully improve and I
am
> > not
> > >> at all sure that the priority is to have such a meeting given the
large
> > >> sums of money being talked about in IMC Finance. Perhaps that money
> > could
> > >> be used to buy computers and net connections? 6,000 euros in
equipment
> > >> could kickstart a good amount of IMC in Africa.
> > >>
> > >> What University and Professor are you talking about? What sort of
> > >> fundraising are you doing? Could you send more detailed information
to
> > the
> > >> IMC Finance list?
> > >>
> > >> Thank you,
> > >>
> > >> Chema
> > >>
> > >> > PLEASE ENSURE THIS MAIL GETS TO SWITZERLAND INDYMEDIA-
> > >> > WE HAVE NO CONTACT AND NO REPLIES ON ANY OF OUR
> > >> > REQUESTS..................
> > >> >
> > >> > THIS IS TO CONFIRM THE CONFERENCE IS OFFICIAL-FIND
> > >> > LETTER FROM THE HOST FOR THE CONFERENCE.
> > >> >
> > >> > PLEASE, ANY QUESTIONS  MUST BE DIRECTED DIRECTLY TO
> > >> > THE SWISS TEAM VIA THE FOLLOWING EMAIL ADDRESSES AND
> > >> > NOT THE PROFESSOR AS HE HAS DELEGATED THE PARTNERSHIP:
> > >> >
> > >> > gloebell at bluewin.ch or
> > >> > glloebell at yahoo.com
> > >> > michaela.k at dplanet.ch
> > >> > mauranda at bluewin.ch
> > >> >
> > >> > A RECEIVING DEPOT FOR MATERIALS USED IN WORKSHOPS
> > >> > The university will receive but without any financial
> > >> > obligations the materials needed for the workshop-Hand
> > >> > book or pamphlet,please let us have the site page so
> > >> > we are able to have access to the content too.....
> > >> >
> > >> > Please also find our fund raising doc. in German that
> > >> > we are using........this has gone out for one week and
> > >> > we have yet to get responses. There are 3 of us
> > >> > carrying out this task. PLEASE LET ME STRESS THAT THIS
> > >> > IS NOT A SUBSTITUTE FOR OTHER FUND RAISING BUT
> > >> > COMPLIMENTRY.......we need to take care of our
> > >> > Senegal/Swiss ticket of the person who is unable to
> > >> > finance his own ticket due to his status here in
> > >> > Switzerland.
> > >> > When we have a response we will let the results be
> > >> > made available to the group.
> > >> > We are doing "Professionally"  fund raising but very
> > >> > clear on ethics.
> > >> >
> > >> > We look forward to meeting all the faces of the names
> > >> > of the people who are working so hard to bring this
> > >> > idea to a reality.......
> > >> >
> > >> > NeBe
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > but for fate we could have been one another
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Imc-finance mailing list
> > > Imc-finance at lists.indymedia.org
> > > http://lists.indymedia.org/mailman/listinfo
> > > Summary Page: http://docs.indymedia.org/view/Global/ImcFinance
> >
> >
> >
> > Get pgp key for bluepee3 at yahoo.com at www.keyserver.net
> >
>
>
> --
> but for fate we could have been one another
>
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