[Imc-uk-process] A matter of censorship,
antiwar activist and public concern - someone please unhide it
Ecovillage Network UK
evnuk at gaia.org
Wed Jun 16 11:54:25 PDT 2004
A matter of censorship, antiwar activist and public concern - will someone
please unhide it
[this is a perfect example of how the Indymedia editorial system isn't working]
There appears to be something wrong at UK Indymedia.
With the system the way it is all it takes is one garcondumonde to bring
the entire system into disrepute.
Garcondumonde I'm gonna - tedious though it is - take apart your
'reasoning' one by one
This story is true.
I have quoted a Labour MP as the source who confirmed there WAS an official
news blackout in the runup to the recent elections.
You have to ask yourself the question was that blackout WHICH YOU ARE
FOLLOWING issued to protect Kathryn or the PM?
Advisories are not issued to newspapers if joe bloggs' daughter tries to
I have put forward the MP's evidence that it is true - what evidence do you
have that it isn't?
Because you didn't see it in the papers? Have you called the school? the
Either garcondumonde is afraid of the implications of official censorship
to protect the image of a politican or has - like some do at Indymedia a
personal grudge against me, the poster. In case you didn't notice - gdm -
it was the most popular article on the wire when you pulled it!
Whatever the article must stay along with the discussion that followed it.
This censorship is not just stifling the facts its also stifling the debate
over the facts
The suicide guidelines you quote state clearly the dangers of ignoring
suicide - and I'd agree if the article was flippant - but its not
So, several negative comments appear over a couple of hours and thats
justification to pull it?
There is no justification at all here
1. for Kathryn's cry for help to have an impcat it must be heard.
2. we have a special duty to publish suicide stories when it reflects on a
3. the reasons quoted by gdm were entirely partial and didn't take into
account the positive comments
4. we cant even find the article using the search now
5. none of the points made by the Indymedia software writer were listened
to and he can't take part in this debate
Instead you could have just pulled the final wrecking comment
No discussion has taken place before this has been hidden - one person has
rounded up all the precarious comments supporting censorship and decided,
for themselves, to hide it.
So will someone please unhide it ASAP as a legitimate matter of both
antiwar activist and public concern.
0117 944 6219
MY GOD how you have to fight for the truth to be heard these days!
You can tell there's a war on when even Indymedia is censoring stories to
protect Blair's image.
Don;'t submit to this Rule By Secrecy
Re: [Imc-uk-features] [article:293456] infactual? and... CONFIRM!! :-)
"garcondumonde" <gdm at fifthhorseman.net>
Wed, June 16, 2004 12:31 pm
tony at resourceforge.net
View Full Header | View Printable Version
hidden your article, reasons why below in email sent to imc-uk-features
and cc'd to you at gaia.
i've read through this post and all the comments (there are a number
subsequent to ekes' comment).
the majority are in favour of NOT hiding the article.
i have hidden it.
Why?? there are a number of reasons. i will post a short comment under the
article linking to this email as well....
1. firstly, i agree with the comment ekes made about mental health problems:
> There is a __serious__ issue around mental health, schools and exam
stresses. This article fails to highlight these issues because it names
individuals. Reporting, and campaigning, must highlight the many people
involved and doesn't need names.
teenagers are under an enormous amount of stress that is often
unrecognised. adolescent girls are pretty much at the peak of the iceberg
in terms of numbers of attempted suicide: they do it more than anybody
else (although fortunately they are less successful than their male
2. there appears - from comments posted under the article and from surfing
various other BBs found thru google.co.uk - to be some variance in the
details around the story. it is not entirely clear what happened when, and
the story is merely attributed to "my sources" - hardly a descriptive
account of what role/credibility those people may have.
3. kathryn blair has already been found involved in disputes over stories
about her in the press:
"39. Blair MP v Mail on Sunday (Report 47, 1999)"
"...the Commission noted the Code's responsibility to protect vulnerable
children. In this case, it considered that Kathryn would start school at
the centre of a row over the validity of her admission and felt that the
story therefore had significantly affected her welfare at a particularly
it considered that the article was in breach of Clause 1 (Accuracy) of the
Code of Practice. It therefore followed that, because the article was
misleading, there could be no public interest in its contents. The breach
of Clause 1 necessarily would demonstrate a breach of Clause 6 (Children)
in that untrue allegations connected to a child would automatically harm
her welfare and obviate the public interest defence. The Commissionin
line with the precedents set out in Section 1also noted the extent to
which Mr and Mrs Blair had gone to protect the privacy of their daughter."
i think this is an interesting reference because it, legitimately, raises
questions about press adherence to a voluntary code of conduct (please
correct me if i am wrong about any of the details: i am neither a lawyer
nor a journalist!) regarding personal privacy - including the privacy of a
child - in a public arena. there are implications for indymedia, too...
by following the logic presented in this quote (and the full reference,
which is only a few lines longer), i think that the article should be
hidden: there is not enough evidence that it is correct and i think that
the article could be more damaging.
[nb. a medical definition of childhood in the uk includes all those under
the age of 16 and those up to the age of 18 who remain in full-time
My suggestion would be that the article is perhaps re-written, anonymising
the name of the child (although i would agree that the public interest may
be served best by stating "there are rumours that one of tony blair's
children attempted suicide last month" or something similar) in order that
this important aspect of our society can be highlighted.
i note that the article is printed in full on tony gosling's own website,
The All Seeing Eye - http://www.public-interest.co.uk/aseye/index.htm and
i am not trying to suggest that that should be changed as i have no place
to do so. i do find, however, that it is interesting that one of the links
from the article on that website is to "Ethical guidance on the reporting
of suicide" - http://www.presswise.org.uk/display_page.php?id=166
from there, i quickly reached guidelines which talked about "suicide
contagion" and also raised as a concern the fact that,
"Using adolescents on TV or in print media to tell the stories of their
suicide attempts may be harmful to the adolescents themselves or may
encourage other vulnerable young people to seek attention in this way."
i finish with another quote from ekes:
> We want to change things, for the better. Lets tackle issues of mental
health properly. Lets not point fingers at people without talking to
them. Lets involve people in changing things.
love & solidarity,
nb. i would like to remind everyone that no article is removed from
www.indymedia.org.uk - they are all visible by following the 'view all
posts' link which can be found on the editorial guidelines page,
At 08:45 PM 6/15/04 +0100, you wrote:
>I agreew ith what ionnek says - but also think this brings up the old
>issue of acyively linking to other sites - something we don't do
>enough of. I know this can take Indy close to the edges of endorsing
>a tight political line, which doesn't help the site - but i do think
>we need to think about what national links we could promote and what
>local links we could add on the sites.
>If no-one has any problems with this maybe we could start compiling a list.
>At 10:39 +0100 11/06/04, ionnek wrote:
> >Hi, rkn and all,
> >thanks for your mail about forums. Since enrager first started, I have
> >been very happy about these forums, for precisely the reasons you
> >mention, and i sometimes tried to direct people from the newswire to
> >enrager. The indymedia concept and the technology we use really is not
> >very suitable for discussions, imho we aim for "reports from the
> >streets" rather than proper debate. Indymedia is a reporting tool rather
> >than a debating or organising platform. I would like to think about ways
> >to direct people who obviously want to discuss on the indymedia newswire
> >to the enrager threads, and other forums as well, depending on content.
> >Brainstorm: One way to do this would be to post reports about
> >interesting threads on enrager on the indymedia newswire and include the
> >link. People who are discussing a topic on enrager are generating a lot
> >of knowledge. Maybe, when a debate becomes "saturated", people could
> >work together on a text, to share this knowledge on indymedia, either as
> >a posting on the newswire or as a feature proposal? I say this because
> >in my view, debates and knowledge production are part of the daily
> >practice of activism, they always happen for a specific reason, a need
> >in one moment in time, therefore I would consider them as news. Or post
> >enrager links as comments under the newswire postings you find
> >interesting for a particular thread?
> >What do you think?
> >Imc-uk-process mailing list
> >Imc-uk-process at lists.indymedia.org
>Imc-uk-process mailing list
>Imc-uk-process at lists.indymedia.org
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