[New-imc] imc-beirut

[valentine V eben]

Hello Raida! I find it disheartening to read a mail like yours.
You are a member of imc Beriut a "citizen" of Beruit and sound like it will be better if there was no IMC there.

>>
As a member of beirut imc, i want to ask few questions and tell few things:
 1 - how would the imc-beirut be part of the local/global struggle if it is a gathering for almost   “foreigners”? who happen to live here for short time as they are working here (they were unemployed in   their countries and it seems as they have said that it is more fun here than other arab countries they have went to. and i would say that as foreigners they have a better opportunities and access for certain jobs as a result of   the globalaization.
>>

a.) IMC beriut will be part of the local/global struggle when Beruitians like you get together more 
 Berutians to be involved.  People who are in IMCs most not be "nationals" of the country in question. IMC is about a consesus Organised alternative news making; about the daily lifes and political reality in the area  in question as well as the world at large

b.)Without globalisation the noelcolonial regimes that reign in the Global South are being run by Co-operate capital to ease more exploitation. Our struggle is against an oppressive class not and oppressive nation as every nation that exist today have both an oppressive class and an oppressed class.  True that most of the main stakeholders are from the global North but that does not cancel out those from the South.  I do not see how someone fighting against the system can suddenly become an enemy just becuase the person comes from the Noth of the globe. That will imply someone from global South who is oppressing and killing people to be in power should be a friend. NO!! 

<<
 i am not against foreigners. i am against nations and consider myself as a radical leftist activist so don’t attack  me from this point.
>>

A little advice. May be you stop using the words "foreigners and nationals" and start saying those that holder Beruit passports and those that do not hold them.

<<
 I want to know how a local imc would be useful if the group working on it are almost foreigners whom lack both the knowledge and experience of the local struggle that by the way hasn’t started when they arrived here,  and the links with others for several reasons: language (imc beirut meetings were almost in english and i had to argue so they would be in arabic, and after many dropped out the meetings are in english again), i would like to  add that those who drooped out said it was because of the language of the meetings and the process of discussion
Lack of trust: although we know semek and mina and have worked with them for a while, but because we  don’t know hanna and we haven’t work with her before and from our short knowledge of her many of us don’t feel comfort working with her, this we used to discuss privately and it is also based on hanna’s attitude in  the short experience with her>>
>>

a.) As long as those involved in the IMC are Organised in a non-hierachy manner and report the other side of the political happenings in an area, then that will help people see the other side which is what indy is all about. About experience in on going struggles; if the local struggles have to do with rights and justice then I'm sure those involved will get a connecting point to an IMC and thus get involved and use the platform to further their struggle.
b.) In indymedia there is no rule about what language have to be used in a meeting. Language is 
to be used for communication between people participating in a meeting. And that you argued for   arabic to be used in your meeting is a good idea. But if I were in your place I could have used the word "propose" in the place of "argue". In a consensus enviroment people try to share their opinions and come up with an idea that works for the group. The word "argue" sounds too confrontative for a consensus enviroment. Your group equally use both languages to ease expression and communication. 
c.) About trust, I canot imagine what the network can do about that; Expel Hannah from indy Beruit becuase some persons who already left indymdia Beruit do not trust her?? IMCs are Autonomous groups. We will wish that all the 7billion people on earth could participate in IMCs but if some do not want to participate and do not want to solve problems in their local groups and prefer to drop-out then wish them good luck. 

<<  Attitude: hannah’s attitude is very bad, she just imposes her opinions in a superiour way like giving orders, and cutting down our discussions. and when i asked her to stop this in a private meeting she said that she was  told to act this way as here “in this part of the world” this is how things work out, and that from where she comes things are more “democratic and different”, and that usually she is a democratic person but she was told here to do this and that ...   
    i asked her to act normally and to start building trust exchanged trust, and try to mix with the people here with  full respect for them without any prejudgments or superior thoughts. Furthermore i told her that she is facing a trust problem and that to be trusted she should listen to the others and not cutting down their discussion, and  she did cut mine down mine and i told her that she just did it she said that we always repeat ourselves and this is why she interrupts us while still speaking ...
>>

I'll advice that you check www.consensus.net and a few other links avaliable at the http://newimc.org
and your group should discuss about consensus may be. I do not personally know Hannah and it 's your consensus based IMC that is suppose to have recieved this part of your mail.


<<    in a previous email, hanna wrote: “also, we are talking about setting up imc’s in the Global South and i am not so sure if lebanon really is that, in some ways yes, in others this is really westernized European place, take into consideration that it is not only the tech side that might be strange for people but maybe also our whole  decision making, process, etc” and she just say the opposite in another email: “I don’t know if people who are  not that familiar with the Middle East (and after all Cyprus does seem today much more part of Europe than  part of this region) can understand what a great insult>>

I read the two mails in question too. I think they sound less like an insult when taken in the context of the entire mails in question and the discussion then.

<<
 I want hanna to know that we here in lebanon are open minded and welcome all people from all parts of this world, but we for sure share much more things with the   people in the region including cyprus, of those, we share history the old and the new ones which are different
 that the europeans share, and maybe she should read some
>>

You surely could have sent this part of your mail to Hannah directly. Anyway If you put together all the text books and history book about Humanity or Homo Sapiens they are surely going to be
 more than those about middle east and Mediteranian and europe put together. 
All of us from different parts of the world are (I think) involved in indymedia becuase we try to think globally.   

<<
 i still have a lot to tell, but i decided before to just drop out and wait to watch the imc beirut collapse once  those foreigners would be forced to leave or once the web is ready and the articles would be written by  (whom)???
>>

That is a very sad statement to read from a member of IMC Beruit isn't it. About the many things you have to tell, please this list is for discuss how to help forming IMCs become full members of the network and not how to stop IMCs from existing.

<<
  But after reading the non stop lies and attacks from hanna at petros, i decided to write and would ask hanna to  explain her attitude and would like the new imcs to answer my question: is the imc a gathering for foreigners??
                       <?: = = ":::" />
 raida 
>>

a.)The Hannah/Petros exchange I did not keep in my head so I'm not feet to comment on that. 
About Hannah explaining Her attitute; you mean to Petro or to you?? Both should better be an issue of personal emails, and to the most your local group but above all not on the newimc list I think.  
b.) IN IMC there are no foreigners and nationals . There is alternative news and activists and media makers working VOLUNTARILY  to deliver the news.


I find it very deplorable that the small time that I can afford to read mails (I'm also from the global South) that I have to spend it on mails of this nature. You guys can make IMC Beruit happen. That when CNN and their type try to manipulate the world and make all Beriut kids seem to be born with grenades in their hands ready to explode, one can run to IMC Beruit to better understand what is the thing that makes young men and women prefer to risk their lives fighting tanks with bear hands. How we can from different conners of the globe focus and make demonstrations and other actions against the real warlords seating in political offices in diffrent countries.

Solidarity
Sphinx (valentine)
    
                  
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On Fri, 07 Mar 2003 11:30:47  
 Raida Hatoum wrote:


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