[Seattle-editorial] Proposal to hide

[Gentry Lange]

Ok, well here is another idea, or two.

1. Have a Moderated list option, which users can turn on and off, which is
the same newswire, but edited to contain real news (news is definable). It
could be set to unmoderated by default, and a link or drop down box could
simply invite users to turn it on.

2. We could create a separate area for billboard type free speech. I think
this could be a good solution, because the main problem here is that we
don't want to limit free speech but we also would like to have a functioning
newswire. So we just do both. When things that are not news show up on the
newswire we can then simply move the entire item with responses to the
bulletin board area, while informing the writers and reading audience of the
difference between speech, discussion, argument, personal attacks, and news.

I simply can't be the only one who wants a functioning open access "news"
wire, instead of a bulletin board for rants, spam, and crap.

Gentry



-----Original Message-----
From: Jeremy Kahn [mailto:jgk at fifthhorseman.net]
Sent: Monday, April 14, 2003 10:56 AM
To: g at art13.com; List Editorial
Subject: Re: [Seattle-editorial] Proposal to hide


Gentry Lange wrote:

>I like the policy, but what about them just changing their "handles" to
keep
>up this crap? And could we also word it to include others doing the same
>thing rather than just "jake the snake"?
>
I understand why we might want to have such a policy (I'd *love* one!),
but in past discussions we've found it difficult to word a policy that
seems to be general enough to handle the cases we hate (like these
schmucks) but still leaves room to allow "insurrectionary response", to
use the term of art.

In concrete terms, this "ban a handle" has worked fairly well -- I think
these fellows are motivated by ego, and if they can't adopt a consistent
online identity, then there's no egotistic thrill of being The Troll.
(you just become "An Anonymous Jerk" instead, which is much less
satisfying than being "The Guy Who Ruined seattle.indymedia". It's
amazing how much semantic weight is carried in the definite article! ).

If anybody feels like there's a way to structure a policy that makes it
easy to ban these guys without a discussion like this, please feel free
to propose it. In the mean time, I approve of Jonathan and Gentry's
suggestions that "Jake the Snake" be kicked.  What an ass: he's hostile
and interfering, attacking 2 of our 4 principles of quality
newswire-ness, as Jonathan noticed.

--jeremy

>
>Gentry
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: jonathan lawson [mailto:jonathan at indymedia.org]
>Sent: Monday, April 14, 2003 8:35 AM
>To: g at art13.com; seattle-editorial at lists.indymedia.org
>Subject: Re: [Seattle-editorial] Proposal to hide
>
>
>Requires some discussion (not this particular post, but the whole lot of
>them). So here's a quick concrete proposal to get the discussion started:
>
>Proposal: to hide the current wave of right-wing articles and comments
>associated with "Jake the Snake," "Mark W." and similar.
>
>These posts have become very frequent in the last week--a troll
>entertaining himself by goading and insulting readers and journalists who
>are posting legitimate stories, esp. local anti-war stories. Posts also
>include numerous reposts from the National Review and other right-wing
>magazines.
>
>In total, these posts constitute an attack on the newswire intended to
>reduce the newswire's usefulness as an information resource. This is a
>violation of our editorial policy principle #4. The comments in particular
>also violate provision #2, "safe space," by creating an environment where
>anyone publishing an anti-war piece can expect to be met by a barrage of
>obscenities from this joker.
>
>As we have done successfully in the past with two trolls (J.C./Badass and
>Robert Meade "Bobby" "Israel" Deaf Messenger), we should identify these
>posts as a class which violates our editorial policy, hide the existing
>examples, and be prepared to hide additional posts on sight which fit into
>the same group, defined as follows:
><Posts which appear to be associated with the right-wing troll "Jake the
>Snake," and which contain abusive language and/or attempt to clog the
>newswire with pre-published right-wing views from other publications.>
>
>
>At 01:40 AM 4/14/2003 -0700, Gentry Lange wrote:
>
>
>>From "Jake the Snake"
>>
>>http://seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=26018&group=webcast
>>
>>His messages are becoming increasingly hostile. Let's hide this stuff
>>please.
>>
>>Gentry
>>
>>
>
>
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