No subject


Thu Feb 19 14:50:43 PST 2004 

http://seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=26018&group=webcast

His messages are becoming increasingly hostile. Let's hide this stuff
please.

Gentry

-----Original Message-----
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Sent: Sunday, April 13, 2003 9:02 AM
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Subject: Seattle-editorial digest, Vol 1 #808 - 9 msgs


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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: This article should have been be
       hidden. (jonathan lawson)
   2. Re: This article should have been be
       hidden. (jonathan lawson)
   3. Re: Great Rant from the wire (adili at riseup.net)
   4. Re: This article should have been be  hidden. (Jeremy Kahn)
   5. published article (idixon)
   6. newswire attack (jonathan lawson)
   7. FEATURE PROPOSAL: A12 (jonathan lawson)

--__--__--

Message: 1
Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 07:08:43 -0700
To: "Joseph" <relayer at speakeasy.org>,
	"List Editorial" <seattle-editorial at lists.indymedia.org>
From: jonathan lawson <jonathan at indymedia.org>
Subject: Re: [Seattle-editorial] This article should have been be
  hidden.

Geez, Joseph, please do NOT post the internal deliberations of the
editorial collective to the newswire, whether or not you disagree with the
decisions we make. The fact that the archives are public doesn't mean that
it's a good idea to "out" principled discussions you don't agree
with--making it less safe for editorialists to candidly discuss editorial
issues amongst ourselves. There's transparency, and then there's The Truman
Show.

This was poor judgement, and shows bad faith in our process.

At 03:16 AM 4/12/2003 -0700, Joseph wrote:
>I've posted the discussion from our public archive, that were used to
>determine that this not be hidden, to the article in the form of a comment.
>
>  http://seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=25729&group=webcast
>
>Joseph
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Seattle-editorial mailing list
>Seattle-editorial at lists.indymedia.org
>http://lists.indymedia.org/mailman/listinfo/seattle-editorial


--__--__--

Message: 2
Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 07:24:39 -0700
To: "Joseph" <relayer at speakeasy.org>,
	"List Editorial" <seattle-editorial at lists.indymedia.org>
From: jonathan lawson <jonathan at indymedia.org>
Subject: Re: [Seattle-editorial] This article should have been be
  hidden.


By the way, posting the discussion on the newswire gives little indication
of how the process actually works. Here's what you posted:
1. your proposal to hide something on grounds of "pornography."
2. Jason agrees, saying that the post looks like an ad. (member of
editorial collective).
3. Jeremy lodges a disagreement based on our editorial policy (member of
editorial collective)
4. Troy Prouty (not a member of editorial collective) writes, "hide"

Of these, the only post that indicates any awareness of our editorial
policy is Jeremy's --yet you comment that you "hope that the editorial
collective be more condiderate when appplying our published policies on the
hiding of posts." Publishing these comments you disagree with is really
disrespectful. I will be extremely pissed if you ever "out" my list emails
to the newswire without my permission.

That said, here are my thoughts about the article. (1) Jeremy is right,
"pornography" and "inappropriateness" are not part of our policy. This is
on purpose, and it's because everyone has their own private ideas of what
those things mean, and we have to make decisions based on public
values--that means the editorial policy. (2) Jason suggests that the
article is an advertisement--which is a valid reason to hide something. I
agree. In any case, if Jeremy agrees with that, we can hide the damn thing.

Jonathan

At 03:16 AM 4/12/2003 -0700, Joseph wrote:
>I've posted the discussion from our public archive, that were used to
>determine that this not be hidden, to the article in the form of a comment.
>
>  http://seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=25729&group=webcast
>
>Joseph
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Seattle-editorial mailing list
>Seattle-editorial at lists.indymedia.org
>http://lists.indymedia.org/mailman/listinfo/seattle-editorial


--__--__--

Message: 3
Date: Fri, 11 Apr 2003 16:18:23 -0600
From: adili at riseup.net
To: seattle-editorial at lists.indymedia.org
Subject: Re: [Seattle-editorial] Great Rant from the wire

There's a world of quotable material out there on the web from the Founding
Fathers supporting this poster's assertion. As long as we're not asking the
question "What good will it do?", I say it'd be a good story.

Adili

Quoting Gentry Lange <g at art13.com>:

> I propose that with editing and links this would make a great article
> for
> the center column. It was found here:
>
> http://seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=25652&group=webcast
>
> --Gentry
>
> "I am sick to death of these self-proclaimed "patriots" demanding that
> they
> "are America". They are not. They are the willing, eager dupes of a
> profoundly corrupt, dishonest, and evil group of pandering demagogues,
> plutocrats, and imperialists who have hijacked power in this country.
>
> ... YOU leave. YOU go to Canada. YOU go somewhere else. WE are America,
> not
> you. WE are the ones who uphold true American values: liberty, decency,
> kindness, justice, freedom, all of it. WE are the real Americans. YOU
> are
> brownshirts, thugs, and subversives. YOU are the fake Americans. YOU
> are
> supporters of those who are perverting the meaning and power of America.
> WE
> are the patriots. WE are the inheritors of this land. YOU are the
> wronging
> party, the injust, the corrupt, the traitors.
>
> I am SICK and TIRED of hearing these "conservatives" and "pro-war"
> proponents of illegal, injust conquests, occupations, and colonizations
> parading themselves around in front of radio microphones and television
> cameras announcing to the world that they are "patriotic" and everyone
> else
> around them is some sort of evil, wrong, traitor. ... YOU are the
> traitors.
> YOU are the perverters of the meaning of this land and its government
> and
> values. YOU are the people who should pack up your bags and leave
> forever.
> Go on, get lost. There are plenty of tinpot dictatorships in the world
> where
> you and your ilk will fit in just fine.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: seattle-editorial-admin at lists.indymedia.org
> [mailto:seattle-editorial-admin at lists.indymedia.org]On Behalf Of
> seattle-editorial-request at lists.indymedia.org
> Sent: Wednesday, April 09, 2003 9:02 AM
> To: seattle-editorial at lists.indymedia.org
> Subject: Seattle-editorial digest, Vol 1 #805 - 2 msgs
>
>
> Send Seattle-editorial mailing list submissions to
> 	seattle-editorial at lists.indymedia.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> 	http://lists.indymedia.org/mailman/listinfo/seattle-editorial
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> 	seattle-editorial-request at lists.indymedia.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> 	seattle-editorial-admin at lists.indymedia.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Seattle-editorial digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. Request for removal (Troy Prouty)
>    2. newswire disruption (Jason Reep)
>
> -- __--__--
>
> Message: 1
> From: "Troy Prouty" <poeftr at hotmail.com>
> To: seattle-editorial at lists.indymedia.org
> Date: Tue, 08 Apr 2003 16:30:48 +0000
> Subject: [Seattle-editorial] Request for removal
>
> Many of these post are either duplicates or has lack of content -
> Or is a fabrication against Indy Media and other Left wing sources.
>
> Please check this out and remove which one's you feel the need:
>
> http://www.seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=25395&group=webcast
>
>
>
> http://www.seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=25409&group=webcast
>
>
> http://www.seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=25394&group=webcast
>
>
> http://www.seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=25384&group=webcast
>
> http://www.seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=25366&group=webcast
>
> http://www.seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=25362&group=webcast
>
> http://www.seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=25357&group=webcast
>
> http://www.seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=25324&group=webcast
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
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>
> -- __--__--
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Tue, 08 Apr 2003 10:01:50 -0700
> From: Jason Reep <jasonr at speakeasy.net>
> To: editorial at seattle.indymedia.org
> Subject: [Seattle-editorial] newswire disruption
>
> is anyone else beginning to be aware of intentional disruption on the
> newswire. two pen-names in particular are standing out.  One just
> called
> Mark and another going by "AAP NEWSWIRE".  Not sure that it warrants
> broad action just yet but it's becoming clear that the effort it being
> made again to at very least water down the newswire.
>
> -jason
>
>
>
> -- __--__--
>
> _______________________________________________
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> Seattle-editorial at lists.indymedia.org
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>
>
> End of Seattle-editorial Digest
>
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> http://lists.indymedia.org/mailman/listinfo/seattle-editorial
>



--__--__--

Message: 4
Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 12:52:50 -0700
From: Jeremy Kahn <jgk at fifthhorseman.net>
To: jonathan lawson <jonathan at indymedia.org>,
	List Editorial <seattle-editorial at lists.indymedia.org>
Subject: Re: [Seattle-editorial] This article should have been be  hidden.

jonathan lawson wrote:

<snip discussion of the propriety of posting this discussion to the list>

> (1) Jeremy is right, "pornography" and "inappropriateness" are not
> part of our policy. This is on purpose, and it's because everyone has
> their own private ideas of what those things mean, and we have to make
> decisions based on public values--that means the editorial policy.

That is indeed where I was going with my comments. Thanks for the
clarification.

> (2) Jason suggests that the article is an advertisement--which is a
> valid reason to hide something. I agree. In any case, if Jeremy agrees
> with that, we can hide the damn thing.

I think it's borderline advertising. Here's my sense of it:

"it's not advertising" for one, it's a free (open-source!) tool, and
they're trying to get information out. Imagine that someone had
developed an open-source "Carnivore blocker" -- would it not be a
worthwhile newswire item to post about that? and yet, it might look very
similar to the one we're posting about -- though probably without naked
fat men.

"it is advertising"  it's a request for people to visit a different web
site and download something. Sounds like a spam request.

I'm willing to go with the group and hide it, based on two reasons:

(1) it's borderline advertising, as discussed above.
(2) joe, in his "dirty laundry" newswire comment, raises a concern he
never raised in this forum -- safe space. I am not convinced that this
picture violates those concerns, but I'm willing to go with the
benefit-of-the-doubt here -- it does seem to be mocking and unfair.

Somebody hide the sucker, already.

--jeremy




--__--__--

Message: 5
Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 18:09:59 -0700
From: idixon <dixon at idixon.com>
To: editorial at seattle.indymedia.org
Subject: [Seattle-editorial] published article

I accidentally posted similar article twice. Could your please
remove the first one posted at 5:43pm?
Photos of April 12th March in Seattle

Sorry for the duplication
thank you
Dixon Hamby


--__--__--

Message: 6
Date: Sun, 13 Apr 2003 03:21:38 -0700
To: editorial at seattle.indymedia.org
From: jonathan lawson <jonathan at indymedia.org>
Subject: [Seattle-editorial] newswire attack

Hey editorial folks,

As others have mentioned recenrly, our newswire appears to be suffering an
attack from one or more posters who mostly repost right-wing hate articles
against the anti-war movement or pro-Israel posts. Could be connected to
the recent rise of nazi/racist presence at anti-war rallies? Anyway, let's
open a discussion about how to deal with it. If the volume appears to be
high enough, we could decide, for example, that the posts constitute a
malicious attempt to denigrate the usefulness of the newswire as a source
of news-thus a violation of ed. policy principle 4. That's how we dealt
w/Bobby Israel and w/J.C..

in the last few hours:
http://seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=25932&group=webcast
http://seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=25924&group=webcast
http://seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=25922&group=webcast


--__--__--

Message: 7
Date: Sun, 13 Apr 2003 04:35:48 -0700
To: editorial at seattle.indymedia.org
From: jonathan lawson <jonathan at indymedia.org>
Subject: [Seattle-editorial] FEATURE PROPOSAL: A12

subtitle: PEOPLE ORGANIZED AGAINST WAR
title: Thousands March Against War and American Imperialism

On April 12, Thousands marched against war in Seattle, San Francisco,
Washington, DC, New York, London and other cities. A Seattle rally in
Volunteer Park drew a crowd of over 3000, including veterans' groups, labor
union delegations and community groups from across the region. Speakers and
participants railed against the Bush Administration's imperialist
occupation of Iraq, and its proposed expansion of war to Syria and Iran.
Protesters also criticized propagandistic media coverage of the war from
CNN, MSNBC, FOX and local station KVI.  Rally speakers included tireless
Seattle activist Jean Buskin, who last week completed a 20-day prison
sentence for participating in an anti-war sit-in at Senator Cantwell and
Murray's offices earlier this year. Buskin contrasted the inconvenience of
her prison stay to the human rights disaster immanently facing tens of
thousands of Iraqis who have been deprived of medical facilities, clean
water, operating sewer systems and other basic necessities, by US sanctions
and bombing.

<p>Police interference with the march was minimal, in contrast to the
miltaristic, aggressive tactics employed at other recent demonstrations. <a
href="http://seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=25865">A small
contingent of neo-Nazis</a> carrying "no war for Israel" signs hung around
the outskirts of the main rally and infiltrated the march, but retreated
behind police lines after being confronted by other marchers.

<p>Read more about the Seattle march <a
href="http://seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=25881">here</a>.
Other A12 coverage: <a href="sf.indymedia.org">San Francisco</a> | <a
href="nyc.indymedia.org"> | <a href="dc.indymedia.org">Washington</a> | <a
href="uk.indymedia.org">London</a>
<br>Seattle A12 photos: <a href="http://www.greenhammer.net/">1</a> |
<a href="http://www.idixon.com/pages/recent01.html">2</a> |
<a href="http://seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=25888">3</a> |
<a href="http://seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=25884">4</a> |
<a href="http://seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=25859">5</a> |
<br><a href="http://seattle.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=25878">Say
No to War by withholding taxes</a>: info at Westlake Park A15 4-7pm (rally
at 6pm).




--__--__--

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